"I have no lease of Tairua reserve, but have promise of one from Natives, and have paid money to Mr. 'racks,. them, and have got receipts on account of rent. Do not see why I should not take it." Another —private telegram was sent to me in Auckland as follows :—" Grace in Auckland to put injunction on 12th Aug., 187 Tairua claim for Natives.. Tookey told me. Tookey also says letters in Thames papers, re Block 27, Hikutaia, &c., are his dictation, and written by Grace. He also says he is Grey's mainstay, and supplies him with all information. Taipari wants Tookey, Grace, and himself to work together. Tookey also says that if I will give you up, that he will telegraph to Grey that he was mistaken, and that I have nothing to do with you, and for him to give up all objections to my lease re Tairua reserve." I answered, "Thanks for your honorable conduct in the matter. Try and get Tookey to -commit himself to writing. Have you any objection to my letting the General Government have a
copy of your telegram ? Guilding telegraphed,—" Will try and get him to commit himself to writing. No objection to your letting General Government have copy. Tautoru anxious to see you re Pakirarahi."
Mr. Guilding having been a party to the original purchase of the Tairua Block P—It was a conveyance from the Natives to the Crown. Guilding was not a party to the conveyance. '
His name appears as a witness P—Yes.
And having therefore the knowledge that 1,000 acres had been reserved, and having the know. ledge that this particular block had been taken, which is certainly the best town site there, the General Government and the Provincial Government having no knowledge that such a particular block was taken, is it, in your opinion, right that he should have used his official knowledge to try to secure that for himself ?—I do not think that Mr. Guilding bad any more special knowledge than the whole public. It is stated in a public document, published in the Blue Book, that the Natives had the right to select 1,000 acres in one or two blocks.
It is not so in specified blocks P—Everybody knew it as well as Mr. Guilding.
That is no answer. That was not in reference to particular blocks P—The largest portion of the reserve was to be made at a Native cultivation called Pukiore, and the other at a tapu outside or at some other place. The block is selected in the places where it was originally intended to be, which can be procured, if necessary, by Mr. Preece, Mr. Guilding, Mr. O'Halloran, and several others, who were present when the deed was signed.
Where is it shown that the public had knowledge that that block was to be taken P—I cannot say. The Natives knew very well.
I am speaking of the Government& The Provincial Government, which owned the land, did not know.—I made the arrangement for the General Government. If the General Government have , made a mistake in not informing the Provincial Government, I am not answerable for that. I did my duty.
That is no answer to my question, as to whether it was a proper transaction.—I do not see anything improper in it. It 'was perfectly understood that there was to be a reserve of 1,000 acres. It is frequently done when private individuals buy, that so many acres are conveyed back. [It eaves covenant to produce title deeds being recited in the conveyance, and gives both parties clear title.] If . the block had been selected in places other than the Natives first said, there might have been objection; but I do not see anything improper in carrying out a distinct arrangement [A private person would have made a reconveyance of the 1,000 acres. I could not make a reconveyance, not having the power to issue a Crown Grant.]
If that arrangement was made, why was it not stated at the time P—For this reason. We all intended to carry the thing out in good faith. I did not trouble about it, thinking there was no difficulty. It was settled that there was to be a reserve of 1,000 acres to be fixed. The endorsement stated that the conveyance was subject to a grant, to the Natives of 1,000 acres.
Did youpurchase ao for the Government some blocks of land at Hikutaia P—I did.
Was a Native reserve kept there P—No, not within the blocks purchased.
Did you lease a block from the Natives P—I and others leased a block, but no portion of what I purchased from the Government ; no portion of any reserve.
It was not kept by the Natives P—The Native Land Court made certain land inalienable, and when they sold Hikutaia and Whangamata, I, with some other parties, did lease the inalienable block, which was altogether outside and distinct from the blocks sold to the Government. Hikutaia'/yo. 1 and Whangamata Nos. 2 and 4 were made inalienable by the Court, except on lease for twenty-one years. The Hikutaia No. 1 block formed no part of the purchase, and had never been the subject of negotiations.
Did you offer that for sale as a town site P—I and others did. I had as much right to lease as any other person. The Government bad a town site in another place, which I laid out for Mr. Gillies, who was then Superintendent. Both the ,Superintendent and Dr. Pollen were aware that I, with others, had a lease of the block which was inalienable, and which the Government could not purchase. It was made inalienable for Native residence. Everybody knew ; it was made inalienable in open Court. It was no portion of the land I had to negotiate for the Crown.
Did you, on the 8th of April, report to the Government that 45 lbs. of stone from Tairua had yielded 50 ounces of gold P—Yes ; I was told so.
Was tho Tairua proclaimed a gold field on the same date P—I do not know whether it was the same date. The first intimation of the Proclamation I received was on the Oth. I am not sure on what date I reported what I had heard about the gold.
Is this a true extract from a telegram of yours :—" Referring to Sir G. Grey's telegram respecting the shares in the Tairua Claim, the conversation related by Mr. Graham did take place with me, except that I did not say Mr. O'Halloran was a Government officer, which would have been incorrect. I said I would hot accept any share in the claim, and objected to O'Halloran'a doing so, as he was connected with me by marriage. 1 suggested Graham might give it to Crippen, who had been a faithful servant of mine. Graham said, ' All right ; we were always friendly with the Meurants ;' and then gave it to Crippen. I have no interest in the claim direct or indirect. I may mention, for your information, that this communication took place months after the application to Sir Donald McLean,
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